Advertising:
T3Technique

Difference between revisions of "Betsys 2wd to Syncro Conversion"

From Vanagon Diesel Information
Jump to navigation Jump to search
m
 
(34 intermediate revisions by 2 users not shown)
Line 5: Line 5:
 
|description=Betsy's 2WD to Syncro Conversion Page
 
|description=Betsy's 2WD to Syncro Conversion Page
 
}}
 
}}
'''IN PROGRESS!!!'''
 
 
It’s happenening! This may take a year to complete, as I'm refreshing ALL Syncro gear.
 
  
 
== Purchases ==
 
== Purchases ==
Line 25: Line 22:
 
=== 11/09/2018 ===
 
=== 11/09/2018 ===
  
I bought a fuel line [[fire 86’ syncro w/rear locker donor]] for - $3500
+
I bought a 1.8t turbo [[fire 86 syncro with rear locker donor]] for - $3500 + $1288 (to ship)
 +
 
 +
=== 01/18/2019 ===
 +
 
 +
I bought an used Syncro speedometer for - $150
 +
 
 +
''Description:'' needle spins nicely. but the od numbers and trip only move slightly, dusty or stuck.
 +
 
 +
=== 01/21/2019 ===
 +
 
 +
[https://smallcar.com/vanagon/vanagon-direct-replacement-parts/differential-lock-light-panel.html SmallCar Locker Console PCB] - $43
 +
 
 +
=== 01/23/2019 ===
 +
 
 +
I bought a cracked Syncro Locker Console for - $82; eventually get a 3d print non-cracked, but it's functional
 +
 
 +
=== 05/13/2021 ===
 +
 
 +
I bought a new remake syncro gear cross member that can be swapped out with the 82' cross member. The reason I went this route also was to have the existing syncro in tact so I could determine proper balance / measurements of install.
 +
 
 +
[https://th-bus.parts/reparaturbleche/ TH Parts & More] - Gear Support $600 shipped
  
 
== Decisions ==
 
== Decisions ==
 +
 +
=== Front Diff ===
 +
 +
'''Options:'''
 +
 +
:* Sport VC
 +
:* Front Locker - [https://weddleindustries.com/product/1004202 Peloquin Automatic Torque Biasing (ATB) locking 
differential]
  
 
=== Transaxle ===
 
=== Transaxle ===
Line 33: Line 57:
 
'''Options:'''
 
'''Options:'''
  
:* Front Locker - [https://weddleindustries.com/product/1004202 Peloquin Automatic Torque Biasing (ATB) locking 
differential]
+
:* Rear Locker (included with donor)
:* Rear Locker
+
:* Guard Transaxle - (GT) Billet Aluminum Gear Carrier Housing)
:* (Guard Transaxle - GT) Billet Aluminum Gear Carrier Housin)
+
:* [https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2150825 Guard Transaxle (GT) mainshaft 1&2]
 
. . .
 
. . .
  
Line 41: Line 65:
  
 
=== References ===
 
=== References ===
 +
 +
[https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=349105 Samba - Converting a 2WD Westy into a Syncro Westy]
  
 
[https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7959346 Samba - 2WD to 4WD Conversion]
 
[https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7959346 Samba - 2WD to 4WD Conversion]
  
[https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=349105 Samba - Converting a 2WD Westy into a Syncro Westy]
+
[http://www.coastvw.co.uk/Coast-vw-syncro-conversions CoastVW.co.uk]
 +
 
 +
[https://www.youtube.com/user/torsen0663/videos Mark Halligan's channel on YouTube]
 +
 
 +
=== Syncro Specific Components ===
 +
 
 +
==== Speedometer ====
 +
 
 +
You need the Syncro's specific speedometer, as it has different rotations due to the front diff than the 2wd.
  
 
=== Diesel Syncro Specific Components ===
 
=== Diesel Syncro Specific Components ===
Line 52: Line 86:
 
Petrol (Gasoline) Syncros were very common in North America. However, no diesels were in North America from VW directly. There were plenty of Diesel Syncros in Europe and other areas.
 
Petrol (Gasoline) Syncros were very common in North America. However, no diesels were in North America from VW directly. There were plenty of Diesel Syncros in Europe and other areas.
  
In order to keep a 50degree diesel install for a Syncro you need a "Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank" not the petrol version. The Stainless Steel straps offered fit both.
+
In order to keep a 50degree diesel install for a Syncro you need a "Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank" not the petrol version. They make the same p/n for a van & doka tank, but the filler location
 +
Differs. Make sure it comes out of a van. The sinka / doka tank filler can be plugged and the 'van' hole cut if no other van tanks can be found.  
  
Here are some photos. Note the curve in the center for where the diesel starter would clear. It's quiet different looking than a petrol fuel tank.
+
The Stainless Steel straps offered fit both.
 +
 
 +
Here are some photos. Note the curve in the center for where the diesel starter would clear. It's quite different looking than a petrol fuel tank.
  
 
[[File:Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank pn.jpg]]
 
[[File:Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank pn.jpg]]
Line 68: Line 105:
 
==== Diesel Syncro Carrier Bars ====
 
==== Diesel Syncro Carrier Bars ====
  
The Diesel Syncro uses carrier bars similar to the 82'
+
The Diesel Syncro uses carrier bars similar to the '83 but the through-bolt for the engine mount is located about 1.5" lower.
  
 
:* 83' Diesel Syncro Vanagon Carrier Bars [https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1861806 Tony]
 
:* 83' Diesel Syncro Vanagon Carrier Bars [https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1861806 Tony]
Line 100: Line 137:
 
This is always the tricky part.  
 
This is always the tricky part.  
  
The consensus is a 4.86 Ring & Pinion is the way to go for a TDI transplant.
+
The consensus is a 4.86 Ring & Pinion is the way to go for a syncro TDI transplant.
  
 
As for the gearing;
 
As for the gearing;
Line 123: Line 160:
  
 
[https://spicerparts.com/calculators/transmission-ratio-rpm-calculator RPM Calculator]
 
[https://spicerparts.com/calculators/transmission-ratio-rpm-calculator RPM Calculator]
 +
 +
[http://scirocco.org Scirocco (Click Gears on bottom)]
  
 
'''26"'''  
 
'''26"'''  
Line 200: Line 239:
  
 
So people say these need to change, BUT looking at the donor pipes and my Stainless Steel diesel pipes, I think I'll be good.
 
So people say these need to change, BUT looking at the donor pipes and my Stainless Steel diesel pipes, I think I'll be good.
 +
 +
== The Little Things ==
 +
 +
=== DiffLock Console PCB Board ===
 +
 +
You can get one from [https://smallcar.com/vanagon/vanagon-direct-replacement-parts/differential-lock-light-panel.html SmallCar]
 +
 +
 +
== Comments ==
 +
<comments />

Latest revision as of 19:07, 17 September 2022

Purchases

08/01/2018

Decided I’ll need the diesel syncro fuel tank to keep it 50degrees - $243

09/01/2018

Bought GT's intro Gear Housing Carrier for the 094 Syncro transmission - $699

10/30/2018

GoWesty syncro fuel tank refresh; sender, vent nipples, straps - $452

11/09/2018

I bought a 1.8t turbo fire 86 syncro with rear locker donor for - $3500 + $1288 (to ship)

01/18/2019

I bought an used Syncro speedometer for - $150

Description: needle spins nicely. but the od numbers and trip only move slightly, dusty or stuck.

01/21/2019

SmallCar Locker Console PCB - $43

01/23/2019

I bought a cracked Syncro Locker Console for - $82; eventually get a 3d print non-cracked, but it's functional

05/13/2021

I bought a new remake syncro gear cross member that can be swapped out with the 82' cross member. The reason I went this route also was to have the existing syncro in tact so I could determine proper balance / measurements of install.

TH Parts & More - Gear Support $600 shipped

Decisions

Front Diff

Options:

Transaxle

Options:

. . .

Research

References

Samba - Converting a 2WD Westy into a Syncro Westy

Samba - 2WD to 4WD Conversion

CoastVW.co.uk

Mark Halligan's channel on YouTube

Syncro Specific Components

Speedometer

You need the Syncro's specific speedometer, as it has different rotations due to the front diff than the 2wd.

Diesel Syncro Specific Components

Fuel Tank

Petrol (Gasoline) Syncros were very common in North America. However, no diesels were in North America from VW directly. There were plenty of Diesel Syncros in Europe and other areas.

In order to keep a 50degree diesel install for a Syncro you need a "Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank" not the petrol version. They make the same p/n for a van & doka tank, but the filler location Differs. Make sure it comes out of a van. The sinka / doka tank filler can be plugged and the 'van' hole cut if no other van tanks can be found.

The Stainless Steel straps offered fit both.

Here are some photos. Note the curve in the center for where the diesel starter would clear. It's quite different looking than a petrol fuel tank.

Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank pn.jpg

Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank a.jpg

Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank b.jpg

Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank c.jpg

Diesel Syncro Fuel Tank d.jpg

Diesel Syncro Carrier Bars

The Diesel Syncro uses carrier bars similar to the '83 but the through-bolt for the engine mount is located about 1.5" lower.

  • 83' Diesel Syncro Vanagon Carrier Bars Tony

Syncro Components for AWD

Here is the list (besides tranny, pumpkin, and front diff) that I know of till I start cutting etc.

  • Front Sub Frame
  • Front Suspension
  • Steering Rack Mount
  • Transmission Mount

Transmission

Fitment

Two things regarding this. As I'm doing a diesel install at 50degrees I need the following:

  • 82' Diesel Vanagon Bellhousing - Weddle (New or USED
  • 83' Diesel Syncro Vanagon Carrier Bars Tony

Gearing

T3gearbox ratios here

This is always the tricky part.

The consensus is a 4.86 Ring & Pinion is the way to go for a syncro TDI transplant.

As for the gearing;

1.88 for 2nd is popular if you use a Euro mainshaft

1.14 is popular for the 3rd gear.

As always 4th is all over the map, likely due to tire sizes. The most popular from known drivers are;

  • 0.77 with 30" tires
  • 0.73 with no larger than 28" tires

Now, let's look at the RPM for my sort of driving 63-70mph

Most common tire sizes; 27-30 that I may do:

Ratios

Tire Height Chart

RPM Calculator

Scirocco (Click Gears on bottom)

26"

@ 1.14 @ 2850rpm @ 39.8mph
@ 0.70 @ 2850rpm @ 64.8mph
@ 0.73 @ 2850rpm @ 62.2mph
@ 0.77 @ 2850rpm @ 58.9mph
@ 1.14 @ 2950rpm @ 41.2mph
@ 0.70@ 2950rpm @ 67.1mph
@ 0.73@ 2950rpm @ 64.3mph
@ 0.77@ 2950rpm @ 61.0mph
@ 1.14 @ 3000rpm @ 41.9mph
@ 0.70@ 3000rpm @ 68.2mph
@ 0.73@ 3000rpm @ 65.4mph
@ 0.77@ 3000rpm @ 62.0mph

27"

@ 1.14 @ 2850rpm @ 41.3mph
@ 0.70 @ 2850rpm @ 67.3mph
@ 0.73 @ 2850rpm @ 64.5mph
@ 0.77 @ 2850rpm @ 61.2mph
@ 1.14 @ 2950rpm @ 42.7mph
@ 0.70@ 2950rpm @ 69.6mph
@ 0.73@ 2950rpm @ 66.8mph
@ 0.77@ 2950rpm @ 63.4mph
@ 1.14 @ 3000rpm @ 43.5mph
@ 0.70@ 3000rpm @ 70.9mph
@ 0.73@ 3000rpm @ 68.0mph
@ 0.77@ 3000rpm @ 64.4mph

28"

@ 1.14 @ 2850rpm @ 42.8mph
@ 0.70 @ 2850rpm @ 69.8mph
@ 0.73 @ 2850rpm @ 66.9mph
@ 0.77 @ 2850rpm @ 63.4mph
@ 1.14 @ 2950rpm @ 44.3mph
@ 0.70@ 2950rpm @ 72.2mph
@ 0.73@ 2950rpm @ 69.2mph
@ 0.77@ 2950rpm @ 65.6mph
@ 1.14 @ 3000rpm @ 45.1mph
@ 0.70@ 3000rpm @ 73.4mph
@ 0.73@ 3000rpm @ 70.5mph
@ 0.77@ 3000rpm @ 66.8mph

So, let's look at the tire ratios I'd likely use

General Grabber AT2:

  • 215/65/R16 with a load index of 98 @ 1654lbs a tire @ 27.0" - currently have
  • 215/70/R16 with a load index of 100 @ 1764lbs a tire @ 27.9"
  • 225/75/R16 with a load index of 108 @ 2205lbs a tire @ 29.3"

Brakes

I currently have the Front & Rear Small Car Big Brake kits installed for my 2WD.

They will work! Per SmallCar:

Hi William,

With the kit you have you do not need to buy anything to convert to a Syncro. Just do not use the front hubs when installing in a Syncro.

Mao

Coolant System

Coolant Pipes

So people say these need to change, BUT looking at the donor pipes and my Stainless Steel diesel pipes, I think I'll be good.

The Little Things

DiffLock Console PCB Board

You can get one from SmallCar


Comments

<comments />